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Post by Sofia on Sept 27, 2014 9:58:13 GMT 1
Remember what weather Beacon Call currently has people Outside the mountain it currently looks something like this. So if your elf isn't dressed for it they will start freezing their fingers and toes off if they don't stay inside shelter and by a fire until they can get proper clothing. It will probably take a long while for elves who're from warmer climates to get used to the cold. Elves might handle hotter and colder climates better than us humans (who'd be dying of hympotherima pretty soon living in a cave in winter without good enough clothes) but they're not invinsible. Example: Choice is from a savannah and has never seen snow or exeprienced cold like this before. He's also just wearing a tunic and trousers, no shoes, and a fur wrapped around him. He won't be able to go outside without standing on furs/evergreen branches and with a fire nearby until he has better clothes - and then he'll still be very cold due to being used to much warmer temperatures (he can of course adjust, but that will take weeks if not months). Therefore, I suggest we make a list here of Climate & Roles listBadgerUsed to snow? Currently wearing: sleeveless shirt with fringe. Simple grey trousers and bootlets. Belt. Roles: ? ChoiceSe example, this guy is not used to cold! Roles: ? EdgerunnerUsed to snow and cold. Currently wearing: He prefers to run around with bare upper body and knee-long trousers. If it gets cold or he needs to hide his face, he has a hooded vest. Roles: ? goldenbraidFrom a temperate climate, so probably seen snow before. Currently wearing: pants set bit more on her hips than waist, a shortish tunic top with sleeves about half way down her upper arms, and a pair of over the knee boots with a touch of fur around the top, all in brownish tan color and long archery bracers. Roles: ? GreywingHas seen snow. Currently wearing: a pale grey halter top with a brown leather underbust cincher. Darker brown, skintight leggings, and even darker brown, thick winter boots. On her arms, she has a set of brown leather braces and thick leather gloves, though the one on her left hand goes all the way to the middle of her bicep. Last, she has a red cloak trimmed at the collar with white and grey feathers from past birds she trained. Roles: ? JaseioUsed to snow and cold. Currently wearing: clothes made mainly from horsehide, and fur from the arctic foxes. Sewn together with horsehair. Good for keeping warm in the whitecold. Roles: ? JuniperSeen snow before? Currently wearing: Blue thick leather shirt, dark leather pants, white sleeveless fur overcoat, white fur mittens, thick dark boots, belt and a fur cap. Roles: ? KeleeroNever seen snow before. Steepside Mountain is located in a temperate climate but Keleero has rarely been outside his mountain home. Currenlty wearing: The "standard" Glider appareal with a blue jumpsuit as base, a wide belt and feather decorations. Roles: ? NettleSeems to have seen snow before? Currently wearing: Snug moss-green breeches with knee-length indigo boots, and a tan over-dress, slit up the sides to the waist with a long hem to the knee trimmed in tassels, front and back. Dress is sleeveless like a vest and belted at the waist with an indigo cord. She wears warmer fur-lined leathers in the colder autumn and winter seasons. Roles: ? No-StingFrom Holt with similar weather as Beacon Call and arrived in winter clothes. Roles: ? PanaethaUsed to live in a very thick forest. What was the weather like there? Has she seen snow? Currently wearing: skin-tight body suit made of black leather with tan accents. wears a long-sleeved, fur-lined dress in the cold, of similar colors. Roles: ? ReefshadowSeems very well adapted to the cold - how will he handle summer? Roles: ? RokutaFrom subtropical climate, never seen snow before. Currently wearing: a jumper in white with wide sleeves under a navy blue, hip long waistcoat. Loose trousers in the same color and black moccasins made of cloth. He wears a light blue cloth around his waist as a belt and sometimes uses this as a headscarf. Roles: ? SilverthornFrom a hot and dry climate. Ever seen snow? Currently wearing: Gray-green sleeveless tunic with ragged edges and a hood, over a reddish brown long-sleeved shirt. The tunic's collar is trimmed with bridled brown fur. A sash of black fabric around his midsection. Long dark brown pants and high boots tied with leather straps. Roles: ? SlinkerSeems to have seen snow before? Currently wearing: Forest green breeches, a sleeveless brown vest belted at the waist with a red cord. Wears a black loincloth with red trim (worn over the breeches) that is long to the knee front and back. Roles: ? SunsetFrom a desert climate. Currently wearing: Short shorts in gold leather, a woven halter top in dark gold, soft leather thigh-high boots. Roles: ? Swift-WindFrom Holt with similar weather as Beacon Call and arrived in winter clothes. Roles: ? TinderFrom a desert climate. Has fire-magic to keep herself warm (though will probably become exhausted from over-using her magic if she relies only on this 24/7). Currently wearing: A simple buckskin dress to the knee, slit up the waist, and tied off with a green sash. This is worn over a pair of buckskin breeches, boots or sandals, depending on the weather. She dons warmer clothes in winter, usually fur-lined, and insulated with dried moss or feather packing. Roles: ? Please comment here with any adjustments and/or clarifications you want to make about your elf's clothes or how used they are to the cold. Also, it's time to discuss what roles/assigned tasks our elves will get in this tribe. We know what they did in their old tribes, but it might be time for something new and/or different now? Please see the lower part of this list for suggested roles for your elves - they are just suggestions based on skill, you get to decide what you want them to suggest themselves, based on their personalities and the tribes current needs!
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Post by Silverthorn on Sept 27, 2014 19:33:13 GMT 1
Though the weather on the plateau is hot and dry, the proper home of Silverthorn's tribe, the Longvale, gets more moderate weather and sometimes sees snow, though not very often. He's in his winter outfit right now, which is borderline okay for the current Beacon Call weather - he shouldn't be out for days at a time or in a hard wind or rain, but a few hours would be fine. As for roles - it's too early to assign a chief so Silverthorn would work best as a hunter and scout. Would "coordinator" be a role? He'll also likely suggest assigning someone as a storemaster to be in charge of managing supplies, and naturally volunteer for the role. He's a very take-charge kind of guy you might notice... (Silverthorn would also like there to be a specialized humans-scout, as his own tribe has, but he wouldn't volunteer for that - too much bad blood and he'd worry about losing his head to it.)
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Post by Jaseio on Sept 27, 2014 20:44:55 GMT 1
Jaseio could take the role of tanner but she might volunteer to be a human-scout, if needed. She doesn't have much experience as a scout, but she can communicate with humans, though not in the language of the humans of Beacon Call Holt (which she doesn't know yet), but she would like to learn of the humans of this place. And she has Rjúkandi, who would have no troubles travelling far in the snowy terrain with her, while carrying whatever supplies would be needed.
She is also wearing clothes appropriate for the weather.
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Post by Juniper on Sept 27, 2014 20:56:05 GMT 1
Badger is used to snow. She now has her summer garment, but she is resistant to cold, if she keeps on the move. Might need a fur coat or cloak soon enough (preferably white or silvery light grey, but that is only my own fashion wish). She has spent her time fishing, so her role would naturally be fisher. Can also be a gatherer.
Juniper is used to snow. He has his winter clothes with him. His role could be just the treeshaper, seeing how much plans he has for the future shaping. He does also other tasks, makes arrows, hunts, scouts, all that generic stuff.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2014 22:22:36 GMT 1
Just a post edit, again.
Tinder hasn't seen snow, but it can get below freezing in the desert, so she knows what cold is. So she'd probably be a decent cook to help for those that eat cooked food versus raw. She can tan, but I think we need to consider that fashion sense for each of our elves is different based on where they're from. Tinder is from the desert/savannah, so they'd wear either nothing or next to nothing, or something very light. I will point out that she doesn't feel the cold or damp, as a side-effect of her magic, she burns at a hotter constant temperature, an unconscious benefit of her magic. No matter how cold it is. She'll mostly just feel a light chill, like rain on the skin compared to an ordinary elf.
If the elves den in the caves, as some will, until we figure out a central heating system, she'll be able to help as a fire-maker and hearth-tender doing everything from drying furs or leathers to drying herbs. Her abilities can be more useful than just she can make fire. She's also a potter, so if we need utensils, she can make them.
Tinder will need to don furs for outside, though she will likely wear something thinner than the others, even in deep snow. She'll over-heart otherwise, purely from the insulatory properties of fur.
Nettle has seen snow as her tribe live in the mountains/valleys. So she knows what he white-cold is. She's likely best paired with Tinder in terms of skill and ability. They're more complimentary, as Tinder tans, and Nettle can weave/garden/make herbal remedies and craft poisons. Tinder's background as having a brother for a healer could help here too. Nettle would also need to don furs, as in her home holt it's the warmer summer months, so she's dressed for summer not winter.
Slinker is the same as Nettle, dressed for summer, so he needs warmer clothes too. He can do anything really, so I don't mind him being a hunter, fisher, or gatherer, or whatever. He's my jack of all trades, barring magic, since he has none. I think he'd make a good scout too considering that he's a strong sender, i.e. being able to send over longer distances than the other elves. He's like a walking sattelite dish. You can bounce signals off his brain and still get good reception. He's an explorer too, so he's going to be able to learn the terrain better than most for hunting, if you don't mind his wandering ways.
I'm actually not sure how to define my elves for the roles as given for the holt. They could easily fill any of them. Are we for example looking for main and complementary roles, so our elves have a defined main function, and secondary functions in the holt or are we sandwiching them into one role specifically?
Our elves are multi-skilled so it seems difficult for me to give them one defined role.
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Post by Greywing on Sept 29, 2014 0:09:19 GMT 1
Pana's from a place with seasons, so she understands what the four seasons are like. I mean distinct periods of time with distinctly different kinds of weather. XD The thick forest probably insulated their holt a bit, but the hunting grounds and such would not have been. When she was taken, it was probably Fall. I'll also note that she's been sleeping outside while in Beacon Call, using any furs anyone felt kind enough to let her use. I'll also add that she's definitely wearing shoes...boots with a thin fur lining, like her coat.
Greywing is from cooler climes. So winter isn't a problem for her. Summer could be a challenge. When she was taken by the Beacon, winter was just gearing up and she was getting ready to settle for the season, since the winter was particularly harsh where she was.
Roles...well, Pana would be the healer, certainly. In her own tribe, she was that, a cubsitter, and a huntress. She would make a good scout due to the gliding ability, and she has especially keen night vision, considering her cat-like eyes.
Greywing would be mainly a scout and gatherer, and a huntress (though not primarily, since she hunts with her falcon. She CAN hunt without her, though). She would volunteer to scout for humans specifically, but would advocate for a rotation so that everyone does it at some point, since the elves have different experiences when it comes to them.
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Post by Greywing on Sept 29, 2014 6:15:25 GMT 1
Tinder...I will point out that she doesn't feel the cold or damp, as a side-effect of her magic, she burns at a hotter constant temperature, an unconscious benefit of her magic. No matter how cold it is. She'll mostly just feel a light chill, like rain on the skin compared to an ordinary elf. If the elves den in the caves, as some will, until we figure out a central heating system, she'll be able to help as a fire-maker and hearth-tender doing everything from drying furs or leathers to drying herbs. Her abilities can be more useful than just she can make fire. She's also a potter, so if we need utensils, she can make them. Tinder will need to don furs for outside, though she will likely wear something thinner than the others, even in deep snow. She'll over-heart otherwise, purely from the insulatory properties of fur. ... I'm actually not sure how to define my elves for the roles as given for the holt. They could easily fill any of them. Are we for example looking for main and complementary roles, so our elves have a defined main function, and secondary functions in the holt or are we sandwiching them into one role specifically? Our elves are multi-skilled so it seems difficult for me to give them one defined role. I find the description of Tinder's magic particularly confusing. Mainly, I wonder what the trade offs are. If her internal temperature is higher than normal, that can't be that great for her body. Just how hot is she? If she's impervious to cold, essentially, can someone touch her without getting burned? Also, I wonder what powers her magic. The fire has to come from somewhere...does she build a fire and control that, or does she use her own body heat (which could be quite dangerous)? I think if you don't know how to define an elf based on their skills, they should be placed based on what skill is the highest. For Tinder, something to do with cooking seems best. For Slinker, some sort of scout. For Nettle, an herbalist. One defined role doesn't mean an elf can't have other skills...just place them in what you think would suit them best, not only based on skill, but enjoyment of that activity, and perhaps ability to teach someone else that skill.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2014 3:09:24 GMT 1
I understand how it can be confusing. For me it's simple. I've thought out Tinder's magic as being a reflection of her physical health. If she feels hot to touch, she's fine. If she's cold to touch, she's sick. Easy. I have thought of limits on what she can do. She cannot throw fireballs, but she can ignite fire as long as it has physical contact with her skin. Once it leaves her physically, that flame goes out, unless she can give it another ignition source, i.e. fuel - wood or something else.
She is not impervious to cold. She doesn't feel it as much as others, as her temp remains at a constant borderline feverish temp. Her body can handle it as simply as Timmain's body can handle being changed whenever she shape-shifts into different forms. For an ordinary elf it would be a serious condition, for Tinder being hot in temp is normal. I believe that if an elf has certain magics, no matter what it is, they're physically able to handle the burden of that magic without harm being done to them.
Panaetha for example wouldn't be a healer if she was unable to handle the strain of healing. The same is true for Tinder.
No, Tinder wouldn't burn another elf if they touched her. She would just feel very warm, on feverish, but not enough to burn or blister their skin.
If Tinder ignites flame on her skin, i.e. by conjuring it into being, she's burning up her own innate magical reserves, unless she passes that flame onto another fuel source. Then the flame burns independently. She can then shape that flame to do whatever she needs, usually this is slow or fast burning, or cold or hotburning dependent on the need i.e. to dry things or to cook things, she could shape the fire to burn slow but hot to allow a piece of meat to roast for a few hours, or to slow-cook something.
Furthermore if Tinder puts her hands into a burning flame, or something very hot she would not get burned, kind of like Danaerys from Game of Thrones. An ordinary elf would get terrible burns on contact with anything scalding or excessively hot. Tinder would not. Her magic has physically and genetically conditioned her to being able to endure and withstand that kind of heat.
Np, I understand the function of the skills, I simply find it difficult to define my elves into roles because many of them are filled already by other elves. Jaseio for example is a tanner, as is I believe Meadow. Nettle is a plantshaper as is Juniper. What is unclear is if the roles are open to one elf or many. Also the roles would change based on necessity and the availability of resources.
I am approaching this logically.
The roles as already suggested for my elves, are where I believe they would most likely be best placed for now. Perhaps as the rpg continues, roles will be expanded as neccessary.
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Post by Sofia on Sept 30, 2014 22:31:59 GMT 1
Thanks for explaining your thoughts about Tinder's magic, @pyre! Since we haven't seen any Fire-Shapers in action in canon, other than Savah lighting lanterns and Fastfire in some brief Wolfrider flashbacks it's good to get more information of how Fire-Shaping was dealt with in Tinder's old RPG Holt (I honestly don't remember, despite having an elf of my own in that Holt :/) When you say that if Tinder gets cold it'll be close to impossible to heal her, I assume that means "if she is wounded or sick as badly as Cutter was when he got pierced by that spear and still kept fighting"? Like, if she's that bad off her magic will give out as well, signaling that she's very, very close to death? I'll be making a more detailed magic list and add in what elves can do at different magic levels, so we all can voice our opinions on how we want our elves' magic to work in this Elfquest universe The same goes for roles. We can definitely have more than one tanner - I think we'll set the limit at three. I'll post a suggested list of role and magic limits soon, but until then don't worry about having your elf claim a role! We're not that many or overlapping to fill up the maximum or any role yet. And if you're a magic users, like Nettle and Juniper are, they're both automatically the group's plantshapers, just like Keleero, Panaetha and Vareesi all three are the group's gliders, despite Keleero not being much of an outdoor person so he's most likely not going to use said magic to do anything useful for the group yet.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2014 7:21:35 GMT 1
Actually none of what I've listed is in canon. It's purely a fanon creation, i.e. something I've made up based on what I know about fire. It wasn't dealt with this way in Tinder's old holt, either, it is however how I would deal with the fireshaping/firestarting magic logically. Thus to me it makes sense without turning Tinder into an elf-version of Stephen King's firestarter - Charlie.
Tinder is magically strong yes, but there has to be a way to interact with her magic that's logical without making her a living power-house, so logically for me at least, there would be physical reactions or limitations or side-effects of her magic that make her different from another magic-user.
Yes, exactly, if Tinder for example is seriously wounded, like Cutter was or say like Skot was when he separated from Pike, i.e having suffered a mortal injury, and she hadn't been able to be immediately tended by a healer, than she would likely be in a very vulnerable position.
She could last if she used her magic to cauterize the injury, as fire has been used this way traditionally, but if she was already exhausted, and the injury was severe, she would lose strength, and thus slowly but gradually burn out. If her temp drops too low, we're talking borderline icy, blue-white skin, she will go into probably the fire-shaper's equivalent of pneumonia. If she doesn't get her temp up, quickly, or the bleeding isn't staunched, than she will die, yes.
The only way I can think of that might help if Tinder gets into this condition is to chuck her into a burning fire. Crazy I know, but it might help to raise her temp, so she wouldn't spontaeneously combust like an ordinary elf.
(Which probably would have made Cutter panic if he'd seen an injured comatose fireshaper lying inside the troll's forge-fires. This would have made me laugh if it had been in canon, which I know it isn't).
If she couldn't be tended immediately by a healer, and she worsens if her temp can't be raised, but the injury is cauterised than she'd probably be comatose. For how long is unknown. I've never known of a fireshaper/firestarter to be played in a holt with the kind of rationale I've given her magic.
It's new ground.
I simply believe that the elves, like the plantshapers etc who have more natural magics that effect the local environment would have some kind of physical manifestation of that magic that reflects in their bodies/physical condition. Thus the reason I've tailored Tinder's fire-magic accordingly. I couldn't rationalise it any other way.
Water-shapers might be different too, most likely why they'd be wave-dancers or sea-elves.
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Post by Greywing on Oct 4, 2014 18:35:57 GMT 1
I fully agree with physical limitations, but perhaps throwing her in a fire to heal her is a bit much. *chuckles* She's still an elf...she shouldn't be impervious to fire if she isn't controlling it, her skin should still blister. Everything else sounds pretty standard...if any elf was seriously wounded and not tended to quickly, they'd be vulnerable. If any elf's temp drops to borderline icy, blue skin, they'd get pneumonia. I'm not really seeing any fireshaping-specific consequences of being a fireshaper of Tinder's magnitude, and now she seems invincible to fire with the "chuck her into a burning fire" idea. I hope I'm not coming off as too critical, and I don't mean it to be taken personally...she just seems more like a fire elemental than a fireshaper.
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Post by Sofia on Oct 8, 2014 22:09:44 GMT 1
Yeah, I too think throwing Tinder bodily into a fire whilst close to death would be dangerous to her. She definitely should have an affinity for fire and be able to walk unharmed into it whilst at her full strength magically + probably feel better under hot conditions, so putting her close to a big fire when she's sick sounds like a good idea. But just like a Glider who faints while flying falls or a Water-Shaper who faints under water drowns, I think a close-to-death Fire-Shaper should be vunerable to fire. Since this thread has gone a bit off-topic, I've started a specific roles-thread here. Please move your discussion about fire magic to the thread about magic
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Post by goldenbraid on Oct 16, 2014 2:03:12 GMT 1
Yeah Goldenbraid has seen snow, figure the normal four seasons of about 3 months each, so she is use to winter weather, though she is going to need a bit warmer garments to weather a long winter.
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Post by Sofia on Oct 16, 2014 6:12:16 GMT 1
Thanks for letting us know, Goldenbraid! I'll clarify that on the list a little later (internet access on my phone right now, so editing is too clumsy - will fix it once I'm at a computer again).
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2014 11:54:15 GMT 1
I actually hadn't read this thread again until tonight.
Np, I'm too busy with work.
I'll adjust Tinder's magic as required in the rpg threads.
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